Logarius’ Wheel Guide

Logarius’ Wheel Guide

Last updated on October 22nd, 2018

The Logarius’ Wheel in Bloodborne, is a versatile and innovative weapon in your arsenal. It can be great fun to play around with it, and this comprehensive guide will teach you how to make the best out of this magnificent devastation tool. You can read more Bloodborne Guides by Pure Souls here.

Logarius’ Wheel Weapon Attack Rating (AR) Statistics:

Untransformed Base AR:

  • 200 + X Physical AR (Blunt)

X = 125 at 25 Str., 187 at 50 Str., and 219 at 99 Str.

  • 50 + Y Arcane AR

Y = 14 at 25 Arc., 25 at 50 Arc., and 30 at 99 Arc.

Approximate Transformed Base AR*:

  • 140 + A Physical AR

A = 88 at 25 Str., 131 at 50 Str., and 153 at 99 Str.

  • 200 + B Arcane AR

B = 4 at 10 Arc., 64 at 25 Arc., 108 at 50 Arc., and 120 at 99 Arc.

*Transforming this weapon reduces its physical AR to 70% of what is shown on the status menu, while the Arcane AR is multiplied by a factor of 4. This does not include any Odd Tempering/Arcane Gem effects (ex. Odd Arcane Blood Gem with +49 Arcane AR). Revving this weapon with its self buff will drain 0.1% of your HP, per 0.1 seconds. However, this does multiply your Arcane AR further by 10% for each of the first 2 revs and 20% for each of the next two (also not including the Odd Tempering/Arcane gem effects). The first self buff of this weapon is completely free if your max HP is less than 1000, which is great in Cursed Dungeons. With all 4 Rev’s this weapon has the potential to have the highest total Attack Rating in the game… but, at a steep cost! It should also be noted that your attack range is slightly extended in the transformed state by the vapor surrounding the weapon.

Suggested Gems for Logarius’ Wheel:

Adept Blunt for High-Strength, Low-Arcane:

Can be found in the Chalice Dungeons as a common drop from the Undead Giant (Up to +28.7% Blunt; Pthumeru Ihyll Root using Glyph 28nt7p5z; Isz Root using Glyph u37b5h48). These gems are also a rare drop from the Merciless Watchers (Up to +32.6% Blunt; Pthumeru Ihyll Root using Glyph ag77rinb or pwmf22gu; Isz Root using Glyph 5pwujscd).

Nourishing for High-Arcane:

In the Chalice Dungeons they are a guaranteed drop from Amygdala (up to +21.5% ATK; Isz Root using Glyph ghgvhb2d; Lower Loran Root using Glyph ske4igwv); a rare drop from the Cainhurst Gargoyles, but they become common with high discovery and are proportionally better than Rom’s (Up to +19.3% ATK with up to +5.4% ATK on charges/open hits; Pthumeru Ihyll Root using Glyph pwmf22gu on Layer 2). These are a guaranteed drop from Rom the Vacuous Spider (Up to +19.5% ATK; Pthumeru Ihyll Root using Glyph v5v5fpsd). This gem is also an EXTREMELY rare drop from the Merciless Watchers (Up to +23.6% ATK; Isz Root using Glyph 5pwujscd).

Flat Arcane:

These gems work for either build type, but are very limiting and have low damage on all but the multi-hit attacks. They can be found in the Chalice Dungeons as a guaranteed drop from the Brainsucker Boss, and are a common drop from mob Brainsuckers (mob version found in Pthumeru Ihyll Root using Glyph ba362b97, Boss version found in Isz Root using Glyph huy83p9r). The flat Attack Rating added by these Gems is not affected by moveset modifiers and counts per hit.

Poison:

These are effective with multi-hit attacks, but greatly inhibit damage output and playstyle. In the Chalice Dungeons they are an extremely rare drop from Merciless Watchers (Isz Root using Glyph 5pwujscd); a common drop from enemies in poison dungeons. They are also an uncommon drop from Loran Silverbeast (Lower Loran Root using Glyph enjids45).

Note: Beasthunter and Kinhunter gems work great on the Wheel, acting like a more powerful version of Nourishing gems against their respective targets. These gems can be obtained from Rotted, Fetid, Cursed Pthumeru Ihyll Root Glyph exdy2m2t. They are also an extremely rare drop from the Merciless Watchers in Rotted, Fetid, Cursed Isz Root Glyph 5pwujscd.

Recommended Blood Level 110 Build Stats:

  • Pure Strength (Violent Past):

60 Vit., 22 End., 50 Str., 12 Skl., 6 Bld., 10 Arc.

  • Strength-focused (Cruel Fate):

50 Vit., 18 End., 50 Str., 12 Skl., 5 Bld., 25 Arc.

  • Pure Arcane (Cruel Fate):

50 Vit., 23 End., 20 Str., 12 Skl., 5 Bld., 50 Arc.

  • Arcane-focused (Cruel Fate):

50 Vit., 18 End., 25 Str., 12 Skl., 5 Bld., 50 Arc.

Note: Once you reach 50 in your primary stat (either Strength or Arcane), it is recommended that you increase your secondary stat instead of pushing your primary stat beyond 50. Doing this allows both stances of the weapon to continue to see decent damage increases. With 50 in both stats, nourishing gems become incredibly good. Any investment beyond 50 in a damage stat will offer tiny damage increases, so it is not recommended you exceed this number. It is also recommended that you reach 50 in one stat before investing in the other to maximize returns.

Normal, Uncanny and Lost Versions

The only differences between the 3 versions of the wheel are the Gem slots. The normal version is the least viable to have because of the Waning slot.  You can purchase it from the Bath Messengers in the Hunter’s Dream, after obtaining the Wheel Hunter Badge from Alfred’s questline.

The Uncanny version’s triangular slot makes it ideal for Strength-heavy, Arcane-heavy, or Dual-invested Builds, and can be found in Pthumeru Ihyll Root Chalice Dungeon using Glyph aii8vj6a on Layer 1.

The Lost version is more specialized for Arcane and Poison variations, but has access to 2 Abyssal Nourishing gems from Amygdala rather than the ordinary one. That being said, the nourishing gems from the Cainhurst Gargoyles in the Chalice Dungeons have the potential to be better than Amy’s, when their secondary effect activates. The Lost version of the wheel can be found in Pthumeru Ihyll Root Chalice Dungeon using Glyph abbbxezk on Layer 2.

Logarius’ Wheel Overview

This weapon is both unique and versatile. It is the only weapon in the game that has hyper-armor in both stances, one-and two-handed. It also has the highest Strength scaling in the game. The physical side of this weapon is potent with blunt Gems on a Strength build, and carries a generous amount of damage over into its Transformed state. The Arcane side of this weapon is very effective for bypassing high physical defenses. Most of your attacks have frames where you cannot be interrupted by any incoming attack, except a successful parry, or an attack with higher stagger value than your current attack. The move sets are excellent for baiting, trading hits, and going on the offensive. While the attack modifiers of the wheel are terribly lacking, style is not. This is definitely a great weapon to have in your arsenal.

bloodborne-logarius-wheel-guide

An Example of Failed Trading

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An example of successful trading

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An example of failed baiting

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An example of successful baiting

Moveset Analysis for Logarius’ Wheel Untransformed State (with calculated Attack Modifiers):

 

R1 (1.05):

This has a slow windup, but it can be a deadly combo. A short delay between R1’s can cause this attack to hit your opponent as they dodge away. Delayed R1’s can follow any attack in the Untransformed moveset, and can be used to cause a trade in damage. Trading hits with the Wheel is rarely ever a good idea.

Running R1 (1.08):

This is best used to catch your opponent off guard, while they recover from an attack or to close some distance on your opponent.

Quickstep R1 (0.85):

A great counter-attack after a failed attack by your enemy. If your opponent is trying to parry you, quickstepping behind them and immediately using this attack is an excellent way to deal damage without taking a gunshot to the face. It can be followed up with a fast R1.

Back-step R1 (0.85):

Another great counter-attack that can catch your opponent off guard. It can be followed up with another R1 for a fast attack.

R2 (1.15):

Best used when you expect your foe to quickstep into you, behind you for an attack, or away from you after they miss an attack. Holding the R2 slightly longer can catch them while they dodge, if they anticipate a tapped R2 or charged R2.

Running R2 (1.15):

Due to the sweep of this attack, it can sometimes catch your foe if they are strafing, using a running attack or back pedaling.

Charged R2 (1.5):

This is a powerful attack with a 360 degree sweep. It allows you to potentially deal a massive amount of damage if your opponent tries to attack through it or dodge away.

Leaping R2 (1.26):

While it is slow, this attack has a good-sized hit box and can work as a heavy-hitting counterattack on missed attacks. This is the second most powerful attack in the untransformed moveset. 

Back-step R2 (1.08):

With a slow windup, a wide sweep, and good forward momentum, this attack can punish missed attacks or poorly timed dodges. It is one of the best back step attacks in the game and can deal a lot of damage. 

UTF>TF Attack (1.0):

While this has a slow windup, it can punish missed charged attacks or poorly timed dodges. It also has the potential to set up bait for a delayed R1 after the wheel has transformed.

Moveset Analysis For Logarius’ Wheel Transformed State (with calculated Attack Modifiers):

 

R1 (1.03):

This has a slight windup but can chain if your adversary fails to dodge, and can deal a large amount of damage quickly. A slight delay between your R1’s can often hit your foe as they dodge or can bait your opponent in for an attack. Delayed R1’s can be used after every move in this half of the Wheel’s moveset, making this weapon deadly if you can outsmart your opponent.

Running R1 (1.05):

A forward thrust of the wheel and a powerful move in your arsenal. This attack can catch a strafing, backpedaling, or running opponent.

Quickstep R1 (1.05):

A fast thrusting attack with good forward reach, and a relatively wide hit box. This move is best used as a counterattack to go around gunfire or spammed attacks. Overuse of this attack is common, but it has its merits of delivering a punishing blow against someone who is using their gun a lot. 

Back-step R1 (0.95):

It is much like the R1 attack, but the player lunges further forward. This move is excellent for punishing missed attacks.

R2 (1.33, 1.48, 1.6):

This slow attack is easy to see coming, but can be used after a quickstep behind your rival to catch them in a dodge. This attack can be used consecutively 3 times (maximum), before the combo resets. Do so at your own risk however, because you’ll only be able to land one of these unless your opponent tries to attack through their stun.

Running R2 (1.15):

While it is slow, this attack has decent sweep and good damage if it happens to land.

Back-step R2 (1.35):

Although it has a slow windup, it hits hard and has great forward attack distance. Use of this attack can be risky. A very powerful counter-attack if used properly. This attack makes for a snazzy finisher.

Leaping R2 (1.4):

Another slow attack that is best used to counter a missed attack or to bait your opponent. Use with caution. It has a long recovery animation, which leaves you open if you miss, and has a relatively narrow hit box.

TF>UTF attack (0.52):

This attack is not purely arcane damage, contrary to popular belief. It will remove any buffs you have on your weapon, and deals a small amount of damage in a small area-of-effect around the player. It will cost you 0 Stamina and is a nice way to switch states and deal a little bit of damage at the same time. It is however, a risky attack because of the low damage and small hit box. It can also be parried.

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Please note that the Attack Modifiers listed in the Official Guide were not accurate and did not reflect the actual Damage values we obtained in our testing trials, which is why they have been re-calculated. Data was obtained at extreme physical Attack Rating values (against a player with no armor or defense boosts), therefore resulting in maximum accuracy. The method for obtaining the attack modifiers was finding the amount of damage gained per AR. A Logarius Wheel+10 with 887 physical AR and 51 arcane AR was used for this purpose and the increase in AR was from maximum Beasthood to ensure maximum accuracy.

 

Thanks go to NPC_invader, phero_nl, CRYPT1C_D3ATH, and EMonaghan (TurquoiseWaters) for their generous assistance in creating this guide.

Praise the Wheel!

Praise the Wheel


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Pure Souls is a group created by dedicated Souls veterans. Our idea was to not only bring more information to the community on the more ambiguous aspects of the games we're working on, but to bring the community together.Our Logarius' Wheel guide unlocks the secrets of the mysterious weapon and details how best to use it. We also have a Bloodborne Single-gem Fight Club filled with skilled and dynamic players. Keep an eye out for future guides and events!Pure Souls Group Members: Astrichthyes_ (PSN: astrichthyes3), arctic_dan (arctic_dan)We stream our Fight Club on weekends, so tune in on Twitch: Arctic_dan to see the action, familiarize yourself with the rules, and join in on the fun we have!

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12 comments on “Logarius’ Wheel Guide”

  1. Avatar GodlessCrom says:

    Very cool article, and thank you for the breakdown! After getting rekt by many a Wheel wielder (Wheelder?) in the no gem FC, I found myself pretty curious about using it in an Arcane build, and this article helped push me toward an Arcane heavy build with the wheel.

  2. pongkrit03 says:

    That’s nice guide :)

  3. Avatar Pure_Souls says:

    We worked very hard on this guide. Hundreds of hours of preparation, testing, and calculations have finally come to fruition. Thank you for reading and we hope that this guide serves the community well.

  4. Avatar kettpower says:

    Couldn’t agree more, excellent guide! Thanks a lot for testing all this stuff, basically all of my questions about this weapon have been answered…. Have one char sitting here at STR/SKL 16/12 with 50 ARC and I’m really thinking about going 20 STR for a wheel ARC build. How reliable is the data about the base AR in transformed mode?

  5. Astrichthyes_ says:

    The original AR of the wheel in our final round of testing was 887P+51A. We took damage values against a naked SL 100 player with the entire moveset. After maxing beasthood out at around 450, the Wheel’s physical AR was multiplied by 1.7. From there, we divided the difference of the damage values by the difference of the AR values. The lowest damage efficiency value was around 0.68 damage per AR. Factoring in a 2-3% margin of error due to natural def, we got 0.7 for the physical AR multiplier.

    We did the same thing for arcane, but instead of testing vs another player, our tests were against an extremely low arcane-defense enemy. Natural defense on another player would have given us a huge margin of error because the arcane side of the wheel cannot go nearly as high as the physical side with beasthood, even with all 4 revs. The same formula mentioned above was used to find damage per AR, which was 4.1 at its highest. Taking the attack modifier we calculated with the beasthood tests into account, we got 3.9 damage per AR. Since the error against this pve enemy is discernably much smaller than we would get against another player, we deduced that the arcane multiplier is 4.0 in the TF state, so:

    UTF->TF
    70% physical AR
    400% arcane AR

    These multipliers DO NOT affect flat tempering/arcane effects, which are tacked on and calculated after all modifiers have taken effect

  6. Avatar Fexelea says:

    This is a really excellent guide. I added it to the Wiki’s Page on the weapon.

    Thank you for the effort that went into this!

  7. viesczy says:

    Great article!

    That is one of my least used weapons, just haven’t gotten a handle on it to use as effectively as others in the game.

    I’ve seen it just crush things too in dungeons. I got a summon into the 2nd layer Loran, and while the BSB was focussed on me the guy/gal just wrecked BSB. Fight was over so fast btwn the Wheel and my tricked up fire saw spear we weren’t even poisoned!

    Derek

  8. Bearded1 says:

    This is far and away the best weapon guide on the entire wiki. Thanks. The only thing I’ll say is that with high strength and arcane (50 in each) the LOST wheel is the best because you can have two 21.5% nourishing with +14 bolt/fire and a 19.3% nourishing with +8 physical, and with that combo your un-transformed AND transformed AR are higher than any other combination. At that level this thing absolutely wrecks everything in sight in both modes.
    Most badass weapon in game easily.

  9. Avatar arctic_dan says:

    Thank you for all your feedback! Greatly appreciated.

  10. Avatar Pure_Souls says:

    You’d be surprised, Bearded1. An Uncanny with 2x 19.3% ATK + 5.4% Finestrike and 1x 21.5% ATK + 15Arc is incredibly good, hitting 800-900 on its hardest hits in pvp. Amy’s Nourishing is more consistent, but the potential damage is lower than the Nourishing+Finestrike from the Gargoyles. Because of how good the Wheel is at baiting attacks and trading hits, that Finestrike effect has great synergy with this weapon and is probably one of its greatest strengths.

  11. Anonymous says:

    I have 25 Str/50 Arc and have been using Nourishing with the Uncanny Wheel. Any other suggestions?

  12. Avatar Pure_Souls says:

    No, you’ve pretty much got the ideal setup for using the full moveset. If you like to rev your Wheel, 2 cold abyssal gems and a 27.2% arcane gem can be used to great effect (about 660 ArcAR without revs, with 10% added per rev for the first 2, and an additional 20% per rev for the second 2 revs, for a grand total of 1056 ArcAR at 4 revs, as compared to 520 ArcaR for a Nourishing setup and 832 ArcAR with 4 revs).


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