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lordherpie

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#1
I can't find many theories on the undead dragons in DS, but i find them interesting.

2 of them are in the game. 1 in the valley of drakes and the other inside the painted world.
I was wondering if anyone had found any significance to their placing and/or existence.

I was wondering why do they even exist; undead-zombie state doesnt seem to fit the dragons well (being eternal, immortal). are dragons afflicted with the curse as well?
And why is there 1 inside the painting... its a prison right?
Also priscilla's father is a dragon right? sometimes theorized to be seathe. i never realy belevied that theory. Could her father be a simple dragon now also locked in the painting, going zombie?

Curious if anyone has any insights in these beasts.
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dn1nd

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#2
Given There Is Little To No Lore I Can Only Speculate.

We Have 2 Undead Dragon Torsos, One With Legs The Other Without. We Also See Tons Of These Undead Dragon Legs in Izalith, If I remember Correctly The Legs Are Referred To As Bounding Demons.

Now Here Is My Theory In regards To Lore I Can Think Of. We Know The Witch Gave Birth To Demons And That The Chaos Flame Was A Twisted Flame Of Life, We Also Know That Gwyn And His Knights Went To Izalith To Kill Off Demons From The BK Shield Description. My Guess Is That The WOI Resurrected A Bunch Of Dragon Corpses When She Became The Bed Of Chaos And Gwyn And His Knights Killed A Bunch Of The Dragons, Taking One Back As A Prize Into The Painted World And One Escaping Or Even Remaining In The Valley Of The Drakes.

I Am Sure There Are Better Theories Out There But That Was An Idea I Had To Explain It.

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skarekrow13

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#3
There really needs to be an explanation but I don't have one personally. Animated corpses is likely the most plausible one. Here's a wrinkle to add though...

If I recall right, Miyazaki indicated that dragons aren't alive in the normal sense as you indicated lorherpie. This is confirmed in game by the fact that none of the dragons give you "a" soul. While they drop "souls" it's more the collectible kind that any being can gather through killing stuff.

The closest we get is the Core of an Iron Golem. However that's clearly indicated that they fused "the power of the soul" with a dragon bone. Hence why you can make one weapon from the bone (upgradable with dragon scales) and a different one from the soul (upgradable with demon titanite).

So basically all I've added is more evidence that undead dragons don't make much sense without more evidence.
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dn1nd

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#4
I Don't Know If This Dialogue Can Even Be Referenced For The Undead Dragons But Thinking Of This Subject Keeps Getting Me To Think Of It.


Ah, the secret of Seath's immortality? If you have fought him, and were imprisoned, you must know that Seath is a true Undead, different from ourselves. His wounds close promptly, and no mortal blow affects him, granting true insulation from death. It is an effect of the Primordial Crystal, a sacred treasure pillaged by Seath when he turned upon the ancient dragons. So, only by destroying the Primordial Crystal can you so much as scratch his hide

Thinking On The Iron Golem Core Description That Skare Referenced.

Soul serving as the core of the Iron Golem, guardian of Sen's Fortress, and slayer of countless heroes seeking Anor Londo.
Originally a bone of an everlasting dragon. Use to acquire a huge amount of souls, or to create a unique weapon.


These Undead Dragons Could Mere Be The Natural Result Of A Dragon's Corpse/Bone Absorbing Souls And Becoming Animated By The Souls, For All Intents And Purposes Being A Naturally Made Golem.

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Dragonscholar

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#5
I think there might be an explanation to their location: one takes refuge (or is forced into) in the Painted World, just like Priscilla, and one is near the New Londo Gates, a city destroyed and shunned by the gods. I think they both are in a place where Gwyn and co. would not bother killing them. What we heard from Kalameet's lore and Priscilla's as well is that the gods don't mess with dragons if it can be avoided. After all, Gwyn alrready won the war against them and nearly whiped out all of them.

Gough's dialogue: "A ferocious dragon indeed, even mighty Anor Londo dared not provoke his ire. I see little good coming from this, but… thy intent is to persevere… to the bitter end, hmm?"

As for their "undead" status, I think they were cut in half while fighting and are plagued by Nito's powers. So they aren't actually Undead. Just in a sad state.
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skarekrow13

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#6
I've always felt that Gough's dialogue was meant to indicate that Kalameet was special in his ferocity. As in "we'll mess with any dragon EXCEPT Kalameet."

That's not to say that the idea of a few dragons hiding out or being in places where Gwyn and co. wouldn't care is wrong. I actually think it's undeniably correct. The Everlasting Dragon and the Gaping Dragon are proof that hiding out or being in out of the way places did occur. Interestingly, the Gaping Dragon in particular has a Channeler that will help protect it if you didn't find him first.
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Dragonscholar

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#7
I didn't think about the Channeler. You are right. I don't know what to make of the Gaping Dragon. It is so warped I get the feeling that it's just gone berserk.