Discuss the latest Dark Souls Title!
1 
Reply  
Avatar

bukharajones

Addicted
First Warden

Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2016 5:34 pm
Location: Atlanta, GA
Souls: 1,476.00
Posts: 250
Reputation: 7
Wiki Edits: 9
#1
Two years after release with breaks in between, recently embracing these two things has upped my game tremendously to the point I just soloed Midir and Gael in NG++ today at Sl129 without much trouble. I even first tried Gael with the Fume sword in Lapp's armor, so that was sweet.

+Commit to the roll, motherfuckers, or you WILL DIE. If rolling once didn't work, you're doing it wrong and should roll again. If THAT doesn't work, do another. And another. Until you get a better result. You WILL get a better result.

+From didn't put all these suits of armor for mere looks, despite what lots believed and still believe even to this day because they think this is bloodborne with armor - vitality makes you able to absorb more punishment, period.

When people talk about "it only lets you take one or two more hits," if you're managing the health pool wisely, that will be all you need to have a tight and satisfying boss fight end victoriously as opposed to getting stomped in a mudhole. And dealing with invaders - I win much more often now than I did when I didn't bother with vitality because it was a "useless stat."

All the folks who didn't put any vitality in, and I was one of them, going in and doing bosses at less than 30 percent equip for a fast roll that didn't help that much - we made our lives, and the game, much harder as a result. Which is a shame, because a tight fight is a good fight.

Maybe absorption and vitality worked different "back in the day" but damned if it won't make a difference taking big hits from bosses in this game.

Anyway, that's all I've learned: Commit to the roll, like it or not, because this isn't dark souls 1 or 2, and commit to some good armor, because it's not there just for looks if you use it right like any of the other tools in the game.
Last edited by bukharajones on Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Avatar

Lich180

Revived
Savior

Joined: Tue Sep 24, 2013 9:00 pm
Location: USA, the Mitten
Souls: 11,412.50
Posts: 2270
Reputation: 50
#2
And that's why I'm a fat, heavily armored crazy swinging either a slab of rock or an old dragon tooth around.
Avatar

bukharajones

Addicted
First Warden

Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2016 5:34 pm
Location: Atlanta, GA
Souls: 1,476.00
Posts: 250
Reputation: 7
Wiki Edits: 9
#3
But lots of people still go, "What, vitality? Isn't that a wasted stat? Armors just fashion, lol." I'm kind of hating myself, though for being one of them for a good long while.

Polyedra

Obsessed
Commander

Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 1:11 pm
Souls: 2,853.00
Posts: 371
Reputation: 15
Wiki Edits: 1
#4
I always believed in the vitality stat, I really did, but I couldn't prove anything so all I really had was conjecture. Thing is that everyone else did as well. I should've done the math when the formula was produced but I lazily didn't until TSMP called me out on it.

People like to make assumptions based on their belief which often proves wrong. They may be right, of course, but to me it is illogical to make a worthless stat. Much of it came from poise being seen as the only real benefit from armor and by extension vitality, and because poise was very weak at launch they assumed vitality was also weak. Then because defense was not understood it lead to vitality being seen as an underpowered stat because all it did, with those premises, was granting slightly more reduction by wearing heavy armor.

Vitality is good but it is still not a goto like vigor and endurance is because you can still get many benefits from the other stats. All in all I think the stat system, while simple, is fairly deep and does provide a fair amount of choices. Now that is, as contradictory as it may sound in an RPG, an accomplishment from the developers because RPG's generally don't provide much room for experimentation. I say that is a contradiction because RPG's bread and butter is to experiment with builds and figure out a way for you to play. That's not being done today, in most games, because it requires a system that can handle experimentation, and that takes effort to produce. Effort that developers like to forego and instead put in a linear discovery of your character's ability as that is enough to satisfy a crowd that doesn't have too much time discovering a system for themselves. That way they can tailor an experience that is not filled with mistakes the user can do. It irritates me how that is commonplace but it is also understandable why it is so.
Avatar

bukharajones

Addicted
First Warden

Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2016 5:34 pm
Location: Atlanta, GA
Souls: 1,476.00
Posts: 250
Reputation: 7
Wiki Edits: 9
#5
Vigor and endurance are the main thing for sure to make life easier in this game, no question. Then I get my mins up for my main weapon, then I go for the vitality. Then stats for tears of denial.

If ng weren’t so easy now, I would probably go for tears sooner, but I still love having high damage out put with scaling.

But beyond rolling more, it’s the heavy armor that is keeping me alive long enough to really master the fights. You can’t get gud if you don’t live long enough to learn.

I died so much to Midir and Gael and now not so much.
Avatar

bukharajones

Addicted
First Warden

Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2016 5:34 pm
Location: Atlanta, GA
Souls: 1,476.00
Posts: 250
Reputation: 7
Wiki Edits: 9
#6
I have to say, having run into vitbuild invaders in the undead village with full lothric armor on, they are incredibly difficult to defeat if you are leveling up vigor and endurance first and then moving on to damage stats....

Polyedra

Obsessed
Commander

Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 1:11 pm
Souls: 2,853.00
Posts: 371
Reputation: 15
Wiki Edits: 1
#7
You have to get vigor first. There's no other way. So yeah, you will be troubled by twinks who got prisoner's. People are starting to realize how defense work, but with heavy weapons (that you don't have access to in the beginning) defense don't do much. That's why people with good armor and high defense right in the beginning are tough, cause you're running low damage almost exclusively since you got no option.
I get that they wanna win. Me too! If I don't have the skill to do so I need a crutch, so it is sort of a newbie thing to twink. I don't hate on that but I do recognize where they are coming from.
Avatar

bukharajones

Addicted
First Warden

Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2016 5:34 pm
Location: Atlanta, GA
Souls: 1,476.00
Posts: 250
Reputation: 7
Wiki Edits: 9
#8
I don't begrudge an invader doing whatever they have to to find a way to victory that works for them. After all, if you can't be successful at least some of the time, you will most likely quit as opposed to vary your skillset. I earned my invader covenants a gimmick relying on light armor and ironflesh and the black knight sword, which was lots of fun, since havel monsters would surround me and be surprised at how I would poise through their hits and kill them en masse even as I was going to die myself... from there I began to learn other things.

These days I carry a fume because I love it, or the greatsword because I love it, and when I get called as a cop, I am much more likely to kill the invader in a brawl due to my big sword and human pine resin even though, since I don't need the trophy, I'm not trying my damndest to collect ears. Nonetheless I got my 30 and counting with no farming on my part... now I'm moving to invasions proper with tears of denial and regen and all that fun stuff.

Psiberzerker

Addicted
First Warden

Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2017 10:28 am
Souls: 1,851.00
Posts: 263
Reputation: 4
#9
Yeah, with Vitality, apparently a bunch of Soulsbros decided that Poise was turned off, and spammed Utoob with videos about it.

https://youtu.be/qWOuLjU_M2Y

Yaknow, instead of learning how the mechanic actually works now, then made more memes about it. #ThanksMiyazaki.

So, I guess a better way to say it is that some very conservative players don't like change, developed change blindness, and shouted down everyone until the Poise Breakpoint Tables for THIS game were playtested, and published.

Then bitched about how much they miss Dark Souls. Well, let's hope they keep the God Stat in the remaster, so we don't have to listen to them whine for another year. There's no "Right Way" to play a Fromsoft game, hasn't been since Armored Core, that's why they give us so many Build options. There's just what works (AKA Viable) what's Good (AKA Imba/OP/"Cancer") and the Meta where only the 133735+ players decide to ban Estus instead of learn to throw a Hunter's Undead Charm. Because it's apparently uncounterable, because Miyazaki didn't think of that, and put an item in there, to counter the Estus Flask, or anything.

Then blamed "Casuals for it when they finally got their Arena that's just like Pontiff's Back Porch, only without Estus, or anything in the background to distract them from their Honorbro duels.
Last edited by Psiberzerker on Sun Jan 14, 2018 3:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Skilled>Build

Jet1337

Addicted
First Warden

Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 3:46 pm
Souls: 1,044.00
Posts: 158
Reputation: 2
Wiki Edits: 11
#10
That's funny. I have 99 vitality and still die from certain attacks from Gael in one hit while wearing a combination of havel's and silver knight armor.
Dark Souls 3 -- The Doomslayer: Level 802 ☠ NG+72
https://puu.sh/xueua/ca339065a2.jpg
1