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First Warden

Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2015 12:30 am
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Most quests have entire Plot lines and or multiple ways to complete each one. It seems Ive noticed (could just be my imagination playing goose with me again) that when I kick *** in a Questsline, go smoothly, take little damage in fights, or selecting "smarter" dialogue options will net me more XP upon completion of the quest line and individual "plot points" as well. Sometimes ill complete a plot point of a longer quest and get anywhere from 2 XP to 50 or 100xp. Im not seeing a pattern.

(Besides Killing enemies/beating quests that are in the RED or more than 6 levels above)

SO MAIN QUESTS - With multiple ways to beat the quest, is every path going to give MORE or LESS based on performance how fast you finish or what not? Does it sometimes favor a specific path in a quest over another when deciding on XP?

Do secondary quests tend to net less exp?

What are the Parameters, if any, on gaining more or les XP at the completetion of a quests or a single part of the quest?

Im used to playing thru whole quests and getting all the XP at the END and would level up like once every other one or two quests in the witcher 2.

Seems like killing an enemy in the wild or anywhere gives you 1 xp. Bggger stronger enemies like bears give like 2 exp ie noticed. Soldiers gie 1 or 2 based on rank I woul guess and that's how it seems but idk. Ive not Noticed what you get for killing a random Gargoyle or Griffin, etc. I assume every Monster you run into in the wild is probably a contract unless its in a large dungeon section as a boss and a few others that are the exception.

Exploration/Adventuring more Lifelike on all levels, more world and people interaction options both inside and out of conversation, outside main or secondary quests, with a less linear feel while im controlling Geralt in the open world. Making When, where, how, and even WHY a quests is done, more than just one way to find or begin each quest with more tactics and in game real time choice of interaction as well as planning and strategy when I decide to take on a large, crucial, dangerous, or epic quest then the tactics used. Stealth, Swords and Signs Blazing, Manipulation of Events or cycle of Events, and taking advantage of the full unrealized potential open world rpgs have. Give the character we control motivs and not just a que list to click on and track on the map A to B. In the witcehrs story you are Geralt and your looking for a disappeared someone so finding them is your motive and Yeneffer calls you the "Best Tracker" she knows soo... INFORMATION is what leads to whatever our goals are. Information gathering, tracking, surviving, and navigating thru a narrative and discovering the answer to the questions: What Now? influencing how you answer the questions Where to Now?, When?, Even Why?, and the How. Also the variable of time management (without limiting your freedom just making the games story your own even if it has a linear story with multpiple choice or its simply a living world where you make the stories. Time and sense of Urgency are important)

However im not talking about everything being a race to complete or limitng freedom to explore. Im talking about a layer of depth that make the game even more replayable, exciting, and a game where the unexpected cn and will happen while still delivering a solid story. (unexpected meaning something you might think int possible because of the games parameters or "its not that kind of game" but then oh **** that character died! I didn't know that could happen in the prologue!") A new mechanic for the OPEN WORLD game (Both with narratives like witcher or smething like Skyrim or an MMO or a story like a cross between The witcher and Xcom where you can LOOSe and get one of the "UNHAPPY ENDINGS" based on World State your choices cause effect and circumstances plus the situation in which you died or whateve the purpose was for this adventure...dies) so there is an element of choice plus time (and time management only on the most simplistic level so you you can still screw around and do **** but save your game before so that you can **** around and if you do come across something interesting load your game back up and make a story of it). Everything you do must have some point in life and that element comes up a little shallow without the variable of time implementd into open world games of adventure and storytllling and stuff to do.. just so doing every single quest and finding every singl secret to get '125%' completion would have to be done over three gameplays.

I think this will keep the game fresh and keep players from spoiling I for themselves without spoiling the fun of exploration but still making the aspect of time or the sense of urgency as realistic as it neds to be for whichever quests. Also meeting people at places or making them wait to long might have them come looking for you or they might ust go back to their cycles and get irritated when you show up a week later after hours of story and plot have gone by and a week of in game time. Then you have to persuade them to meet up again but if its something like meeting up for the ambush in rescuing dandelion then if you are involved in other matters the quest simply moves forward and updates.

Time, It would be generous enough so that this only happens to add that missing layer of choice is when the games narrative takes advantage of this element and involves choice were you have to meet someone but a boat is about to leave while you just ran into a village under attack by a family of werewolves lost to bloodlust, well armed outlaws, or soldiers trying to take advantage but to have a open world with plenty moving parts and cycles of different level, scale, variation or detailed cause effect consequence and cicumstances with characters being individual units, and then specific NPCs like town ealderman or Gaurds are also a Unit (both in real time lke they have a places to come and go, things to do, people to se and do whatever while havng a weekly cycle of behaviors plus my interctions with them, their interactions with me, and remembering.
Depending on the time the day and the weather plus anything else that could effect a monsters behavior would also effect the narrative of its quest.

Also instead of just choosing paths or choices in dialogue you are given your motiv or you create one and you simple choose in a world of danger, adventure, intrigue, mystery, epic conflicts that are all part of real time living moving parts plus the scripted bits so we can hear our character talk, see cutscens and unlike some RPGS or MMOs your are brought closer to your charater and te world doesn't feel empty, nor does your character.

With your characters motivs and the exsiting motives of other characters and even random NPCs discovering alternatives when you fail in the plot (in a quest. Quests shouldn't be the structure of an open world. The world is the structure where cause effect action reaction time circumstance sitations and outcomes take place in PLOT that may lead to very bad situations where your down to one or two choices and someone is going to die regardless or maybe your just that good and know how to save everyone nut risng more at the time. A world where your choices place every companion and any NPC or main character at risk of all sorts of injury, friendships tested, fall outs, and even death...

(This would work better in a game like Inqusition where you create character and then choose your companions from a list of 10. If that list was doubled even tripled while adding the element of betrayal tha could of been your indirect influence or the NPCs sole motive the entire time making even black and white choices unpredictable like making that companion approve all the time or fall in love with maing the betrayal easier or harder while ignoring the character at the right times, also having command over characters with the possibility of betrayal brings in a dynmic level of mechanics youd need to control moral, manipulate, deceive, lie, cheat, backstab, conspire, cover up, persuade, influence, warn, intimidate, give orders, discipline and reward, etc etc (without it just being a choice every so often it should be a choice whenever it can be

people and places that don't just react to me but allow me to react to them and interact with them more in depth so that It doesn't start to feel like Im just the 'favor king'/task maste while also being the 'questions-about-ciri-king' going around asking questions, getting asked or begged to do each quest that I cant just mark on my map and travel A to B. Most of the games quests, hunts, etc are fine and a love the dynamics of choice cause and effect but I think the element of When I do a quest or what quests I choose to do first needs to be part of open world rpgs like this. Before the questing begins I shoud have multiple strategic even, ways to approach, initiate, and complete with even more multiple ways to complete a mission not just multiple choices and ong term or short term cause and effect or consequence.

This adds an additional layer of depth without being complicated at all. Not only do I want to see the story unfold and make choices and see different consequences down several different paths to different end. I also want to feel lke I have more dynamic control over how I complete a quest, especially ones that are crucial or dangerous while stealth or guns blazing, politics, deceptions and careful manipulation of charcaters and NPCs and facing the consequences of getting :caught up in lies" or put in a situations based on my actions inside a quests, before the quest begins and whatever I do that can effect the amount of options I have completeing a quest and then of course the
Picking up a contract for a monster is the basic way to implement these hunts but the open world needs to also reflect what is described on the contract like If its simpy that the village is being terrorized or an Area is being TERRORIZED by a beast then lets see this in actionas much as possible. I want to see a village being terrorized as I ride by not just a scripted thing but maybe a "dynamic behavior and event scripting" thing could have particular events that start to cycle a in game day or week after you discover a specific REGION. (not just a village or wherever there is a sign post but regions in which these things are placed.)

Going around unloking and doing everything all over every region from the Wolven Glade area, the Coastal area, The Cannibals camps, The bog Marsh region, etc. is not only without Narrative but lacks one of the strongest elements in Open world games. Cause and effect. choice and consequence in the story beats of any type of activity or quest. Its more immersive when you are exploring, tain your time and having much more to interact with othe than quest givers or marking you rmap and trotting to the mark, complete activity, fast travel to next, get new quest go to mrer and complete its choices, etc etc etc. Intead having to listen to people, talk to NPCs (NPCs should have more than 2 or 3 things to say and I should have the option to approach someone or maybe they try to get my attention and a ! appears over their head. I can hear the person out or while in low profile neutral stance/sheathed weapons, id have a set of social interactions and specific approaches to interacting with a person both physical like gestures and a set of things to say when opening up a convo with an NPC based on my own motivations and also tactics. I like the books and other things you can read around like posted notes but these should all be influences on questing and instead of having explanations of areas on the map when you put the cursor over a sign, this kind of info would come from villagers and put together as a whole in the journal even complete with the actual conversation if not shortened version.

Time place, person and self should all play a role in choice and consequence of cause and effect on different paths, and in different The main spine of the story or plot can be written with its multiple paths and characters are going to be quests givers but in witcher 3 I feel like every quest is either a favor asked, or Geralt's character motiv, and people begging to be saved. which fits the themes of the story but I don't want to always be the one the chooses to start a quest and quests should have multiple ways to start, complete, or whatever goal/motiv there is it should be something that I can take on or have to take on with strategy and more attention to tactics and details. Just to paint a clear picture of what im describing heres an example: Geralt is searching for Ciri as the Wild Hunt Chases her as well.

There's stories everywhere but the bottomline is, to achieve a lifelike open world with a narrative wthout making the open world gimmicky or an illusion to make it seem more immersive, then the NPC role of 'QUEST GIVERS' needs to be rid of or reduced to specific activities and the !' marked quest types. the choice of where you go and what you do and when you do it needs to be more influenced by a Narrative put together on the basic cycle of events from sun up to sun down, sleeping, waitng, going to work, or playing if its a child, and opening up shop. Running in from the cold rain, and conversation/gossip overheard, etc


Chosen Undead


Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2016 4:54 am
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About XP: The XP is proportional to the level of the quest (or foe) and to your level. Completing a quest or defeating a foe 5 levels lower than your current level will get you almost no XP. You can try to optimize that by making sure that you do lower level quests first, but in the end it is hard to keep up with that. Also, it really doesn't matter much. Play the stuff you like and it evens out in the end. Just use the levels of foes and quests as a guide to avoid challenges above your ability.

About the linearity of the quests: I don't have the impression that all quests are linear. There are consequences to decisions you make. Some are not directly visible and the impact shows up later, others result in mutually exclusive quests.

About quests having no narrative: That's puzzling to me. I can't remember such quests. In fact all quests have narrative and most have cutscenes. However, you can stumble upon a quest, without meeting the quest giver. In that case you've missed that conversation. And, in that case, if the ending of such a quest doesn't require you to backtrack to the quest giver then perhaps there isn't any conversation. Still, Geralt will most likely have a monologue telling you what is going on. Treasure hunts may not have narrative, but they usually have books near the loot telling you about the lore. But any content is always custom made. There is great attention to detail.

About the living world: It's not perfect. That's for sure. To me it is still enough that I can drown in that world. Any flaws that it has aren't enough to break my suspension of disbelief. I'm sure that over time we'll see games with better open worlds. It's also how you look at it. To me it is not bad at all. Have look through other eyes: There are two interesting videos about how archeologists looks at the world of the Witcher, one about the country side and one about Novigrad.

"There is a high statistical probability of death by gunshot. A punch to the face is also likely." - Legion.