Dedicated to digging into the game's lore. Bring your thinking caps.
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CakeThiefPro

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#1
Hello fellow forum users (ok that sounded better in my head), I know not many new theories are discussed in the Dk1 archives any more because the lore has been talked about so much although it's nice when something new is suggested. I think it's safe to assume that a lot of the lore has now been covered by multiple youtubers or forum users all with their own take on certain characters and events to the point that it feels like I know almost everything that it is possible to know.

I thought it would be fun to be tested on how much I really know and understand by anyone that happens to still visit the Dk1 archives. So, I invite everyone to leave me the most difficult question they can think of regarding the lore whether it's a fact such as "What happened to each of the three Sealers?" or more theoretical such as "Who was the Firstborn son of Gwyn?" My hope is that I'll discover some new things about the lore that I over-looked or perhaps that I'll simply be reminded of things I've forgotten. I promise not to Google the answers as that would completely defeat the purpose of this thread and if anyone manages to tell me something I don't know I will attempt to draw their favourite Dark Souls character in paint.

If anyone's interested I check the forums quite regularly so don't hold back.
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Leachon

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#2
"How old is Lautrec, in terms of when humans began becoming undead? Who was his first patron god? And why would he kill a fire keeper?"
"Never hurts to splurge when your days are numbered." -Undead Merchant

Delam_Farano

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#3
Who created the Dark Ember, and why?

CakeThiefPro

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#4
Leachon wrote:"How old is Lautrec, in terms of when humans began becoming undead? Who was his first patron god? And why would he kill a fire keeper?"


Wow, I actually have no idea how old Lautrec is. The only information I know about his age is that his hairstyle is described as being a young persons hairstyle if it's the one I'm thinking about but that doesn't really mean much.

His first patron God was Feena (or Fina? forgive my spelling!) who some people speculate is actually Gwynevere. This kind of links into the third. Considering he still has the firekeeper soul when we find him in Anor Londo it's quite clear he doesn't want to consume it himself. He could be offering the soul to Fina as he is found just outside Gwynevere and maybe wants to please her although his dialogue made it sound like more of a casual decision to me. I think someone suggested he might be on a mission for the dark although he spares any firekeeper he can't easily kill and shows no obvious signs of desiring this.

I'm pretty sure I failed on the age thing so feel free to name someone.
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Leachon

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#5
CakeThiefPro wrote:
Leachon wrote:"How old is Lautrec, in terms of when humans began becoming undead? Who was his first patron god? And why would he kill a fire keeper?"


Wow, I actually have no idea how old Lautrec is. The only information I know about his age is that his hairstyle is described as being a young persons hairstyle if it's the one I'm thinking about but that doesn't really mean much.

His first patron God was Feena (or Fina? forgive my spelling!) who some people speculate is actually Gwynevere. This kind of links into the third. Considering he still has the firekeeper soul when we find him in Anor Londo it's quite clear he doesn't want to consume it himself. He could be offering the soul to Fina as he is found just outside Gwynevere and maybe wants to please her although his dialogue made it sound like more of a casual decision to me. I think someone suggested he might be on a mission for the dark although he spares any firekeeper he can't easily kill and shows no obvious signs of desiring this.

I'm pretty sure I failed on the age thing so feel free to name someone.


Oscar, the knight of Astora
"Never hurts to splurge when your days are numbered." -Undead Merchant

CakeThiefPro

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#6
Delam_Farano wrote:Who created the Dark Ember, and why?


Now I don't remember there being an official answer to this but I would assume the Blacksmith Deity as I believe all embers originate from him. I actually assumed that the Divine Ember +10 and the Dark Ember were traded between Gwyn and Nito as a part of an alliance to show good faith. They each have control over what makes them weak. I suspect Havel abused this however and used the Dark Ember to create the Occult Club as a part of his plot against the Gods. I wont go into the entire plot but clearly it failed and the Dark Ember was locked away in the painted world.

If you want more information just ask ^^
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Leachon

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#7
Lautrec is most likely only a few centuries old to a thousand years old, as he has been around since before Lordran was dominated by the undead, but after Gwyn linked the bonfire. Also I doubt Gwynevere is actually Fina as they both resemble different things, Gwynevere is the goddess of sunlight and Fina was the goddess of beauty. Plus I think Lautrec actually tried to kill Gwynevere as when you invade him the structure is dark as if the darkmoon prevailed in his world.

I also think the god of war was his first patron god, simply because of a few minor details. After being rescued he gives the player a sunlight medal, which can only be gained by working as a warrior of sunlight or by working with warriors of sunlight. He also clearly knew why the sunlight medals were given (For assisting other travelers in their journeys) meaning he has had experience with the warriors of sunlight. He is also the only NPC that fights alongside Solaire with lightning enhanced weaponry at few times. He may have been saddened when the god of war lost god hood (Possibly Solaire), and as such found comfort in the goddess of beauty.

I also think he despises the other children of Gwyn, and possibly everything he stands for, especially the fires, like the ones at the bonfires. If the god of war was his first patron, and Gwyn forced him out of god status, it would be plausible that Lautrec would try to get revenge, such as killing the fire keeper when he no longer had use of her, and attempting to kill Gwynevere. (Though successful in his world) I say he attempted to do so as you can find his corpse outside Gwynevere's room with his armor. (If you beaten him beforehand) If Fina was truly Gwynevere, she would have let Lautrec approach her, and not let him be killed when he was so close. (Even if she was just an illusion)
"Never hurts to splurge when your days are numbered." -Undead Merchant

CakeThiefPro

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#8
Leachon wrote:Lautrec is most likely only a few centuries old to a thousand years old, as he has been around since before Lordran was dominated by the undead, but after Gwyn linked the bonfire. Also I doubt Gwynevere is actually Fina as they both resemble different things, Gwynevere is the goddess of sunlight and Fina was the goddess of beauty. Plus I think Lautrec actually tried to kill Gwynevere as when you invade him the structure is dark as if the darkmoon prevailed in his world.

I also think the god of war was his first patron god, simply because of a few minor details. After being rescued he gives the player a sunlight medal, which can only be gained by working as a warrior of sunlight or by working with warriors of sunlight. He also clearly knew why the sunlight medals were given (For assisting other travelers in their journeys) meaning he has had experience with the warriors of sunlight. He is also the only NPC that fights alongside Solaire with lightning enhanced weaponry at few times. He may have been saddened when the god of war lost god hood (Possibly Solaire), and as such found comfort in the goddess of beauty.

I also think he despises the other children of Gwyn, and possibly everything he stands for, especially the fires, like the ones at the bonfires. If the god of war was his first patron, and Gwyn forced him out of god status, it would be plausible that Lautrec would try to get revenge, such as killing the fire keeper when he no longer had use of her, and attempting to kill Gwynevere. (Though successful in his world) I say he attempted to do so as you can find his corpse outside Gwynevere's room with his armor. (If you beaten him beforehand) If Fina was truly Gwynevere, she would have let Lautrec approach her, and not let him be killed when he was so close. (Even if she was just an illusion)


Well I certainly hadn't heard that theory before. The problem I have is that the last time I invaded Lautrec it wasn't dark in Anor Londo but I should definitely go check this again. Also I think Gwyn had already linked the flame when the First Born was robbed of his deific status because he left his miracle (the sunlight blade) on his tomb. I doubt they made the tomb before Gwyn left although I suppose it's possible. Also for Lautrec to be aware of why the First Born was punished it would have had to have happened after Gwyn linked the flame according to your estimation of his age.

Lautrec actually being a sunbro is interesting. It is possible to get sunlight medals in different ways. I think the common theory is that he killed a sunbro and took it off him although I actually think he did work with Solaire to kill the Gargoyles and get the medal. This is why he makes us wait for the reward once we free him. I don't think this is enough to prove he has as significant a connection with the God of War that you suggest but it's definitely something to think about.

The picture is done but you can't upload straight from paint on here as far as I know. I didn't plan this very well so I'll try and find a website to upload it on.

ok hopefully this works http://postimg.org/image/owi0y1yan/

Delam_Farano

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#9
CakeThiefPro wrote:
Delam_Farano wrote:Who created the Dark Ember, and why?


Now I don't remember there being an official answer to this but I would assume the Blacksmith Deity as I believe all embers originate from him. I actually assumed that the Divine Ember +10 and the Dark Ember were traded between Gwyn and Nito as a part of an alliance to show good faith. They each have control over what makes them weak. I suspect Havel abused this however and used the Dark Ember to create the Occult Club as a part of his plot against the Gods. I wont go into the entire plot but clearly it failed and the Dark Ember was locked away in the painted world.

If you want more information just ask ^^

I hadn't considered that - it's a pretty good theory. My own theory is that Velka created it in case Gods needed to be killed for their sins, and hid it in the Painted World (a lot of her stuff is there, so I think it may have been secretly used as an armoury), but yours definitely works.

CakeThiefPro

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#10
Delam_Farano wrote:
CakeThiefPro wrote:
Delam_Farano wrote:Who created the Dark Ember, and why?


Now I don't remember there being an official answer to this but I would assume the Blacksmith Deity as I believe all embers originate from him. I actually assumed that the Divine Ember +10 and the Dark Ember were traded between Gwyn and Nito as a part of an alliance to show good faith. They each have control over what makes them weak. I suspect Havel abused this however and used the Dark Ember to create the Occult Club as a part of his plot against the Gods. I wont go into the entire plot but clearly it failed and the Dark Ember was locked away in the painted world.

If you want more information just ask ^^

I hadn't considered that - it's a pretty good theory. My own theory is that Velka created it in case Gods needed to be killed for their sins, and hid it in the Painted World (a lot of her stuff is there, so I think it may have been secretly used as an armoury), but yours definitely works.


The Velka theory is definitely possible as well. Since she punishes the Gods for their sins it would make sense for her to have weapons that can harm them. The only reason I didn't consider it too greatly was because it doesn't look like she has a lot of control over what is in the painted world. I mean we presumably find one of her bishops dead inside although that in itself suggests Velka was betrayed or punished by the Gods as well. I think Velka's always been one of the giant mysteries of this game and we'll never be sure as to what happened to her but I'm pretty sure the blacksmith deity was killed as well so perhaps he was involved somehow.
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