I'm trying out paragrade for the first time so I suspect that when it comes to the Miranda/Jack conflict I'm not going to be able to keep the loyalty of both for once.

Whilst plotting how to manage that in the SM it occurred to me that maybe it's best for her to get killed by rocks after deciding to destroy the collector base on this and perhaps all my future playthroughs.

I quite like Miranda in ME2 but her part in ME3 is just awful. She keeps banging on about her sister in all 3 acts without any sense of perspective (does she not realize it is literally "End Of Days"?!)

And the big confrontation towards the end feels really lacking if she lives (and makes the subsequent Tali-drunk scene really weird). But if you let her die in 3 then that's another "score" for Kai Leng, which also feels unacceptable!

So I'm thinking that her finally turning against TIM at the end of 2 and then dying redeemed is the best solution all round.


P.S I believe in Virmiring Ashley for similar reasons. Are really great character in 1 gets utterly butchered in 3.

If you think Ashley got butchered in ME3 (I don't) then certainly I can see killing Miranda. Miranda really suffered in ME3 for the reasons you point out; much more so than Ashley.



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I personally dislike Jacob's character in ME3, so this time round he was taken off by the Collector swarm in the SM and I'm looking forward to his absence.   :ph34r:

I may do that every time I play tbh.  :lol:

If you don't like a character's writing in ME3 then why not?  I did just that in my first ME2/3 run, getting Miranda to leave Cerberus.  My Shep felt happy he'd had a positive effect on her, only for her to die as he'd sided with Jack.

You can probably work the system, with good timing and talent upgrades you may be able to paragon the conflict between the two.  If you want to that is.

Nah, it's hard enough getting myself to not automatically hunt all the paragon/renegade points as it is!

I have to keep reminding myself I've already played this a billion times and so am better off seeing non-optimal results for a change just to mix things up.

Nah, it's hard enough getting myself to not automatically hunt all the paragon/renegade points as it is!

I have to keep reminding myself I've already played this a billion times and so am better off seeing non-optimal results for a change just to mix things up.

This is the challenge actually... convincing oneself to make decisions that we know will result in a death or non-optimal results... but it is worth it.  One less emotional way to practically ensure a non-optimal results is to do a speed run, then do a more planned non-optimal run right afterwards.  After the "disastrous" speed run, the other non-optimal run just really seems like a step up (as opposed to a step down after doing a run where everyone lives, etc.)


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For me, I just avoid ME3.  I still ME3 MP, just no SP at all.


Crystal Cave
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Jeez, Tonymac. In which universe would that be considered a helpful response?

OP, it's your game. If you like it better with Miranda dead, then get her killed
IMO better to kill everyone including Shep in ME2, skip ME3 and jump directly to ME:A when it comes out.



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I noticed there's some similarities with Miranda and Ashley in ME3 only to realize they're both written by Jay Watamaniuk. But I don't think Miri was badly done considering I hardly saw her anyway. But her narrative would have been made even more interesting and engaging if it was revealed that the entire time her father was in cohort with The Illusive Man. Which meant Miranda was played by TIM and that she didn't fully escape her father, and she literally handed Oriana over to him in ME2 by using her Cerberus contacts. Also, she should have been made to investigate Cerberus and the implants for Shepard. None of this was massive change but it simply refocus her motivations outside the whole "my little sister is missing and I have to do it all alone". But I don't think she deserve death from weak writing which really isn't as bad as Ash but it depends on how OP feels about it anyway... using the same sentiment, I would have left Garrus to die to avoid "just like old times" when I was absolutely a **** to him in ME1.


I agree about Miranda in ME3. Millions are dying daily, and Miranda is just looking for her sister?!

It is rather difficult to kill her in ME2 though. She can only die in the last part of the suicide mission. In ME3, however, I think the developers wanted her to die. If she wasn't loyal in ME2, she dies. If you don't tell her about Kai Lang, she dies. If you break up with her, she dies. If you don't give her Alliance resources, she dies. As you mentioned, the drunk Tali scene feels very out of place if she survives. It's clearly meant for her to be dead.

As to your question, it's up to you. Why can't you get her loyalty after the Jack confrontation just because you're playing paragade? I've played paragade and never had any trouble. Even if you can't resolve the initial conflict neutrally, afterwards, all companions involved can be swayed to get back their loyalty.